------- start of digest (RFC 934 encapsulation) ------- Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 10:05:50 +0200 From: Paul Guyot Subject: [NPDS] Towards NPDS 3, let's summarize Hi all, First, even if there is that disconnecting bug (btw, it actually disables an endpoint), I consider that the new nHTTPd is stable enough to work as it for a while. So I can focus on NPDS 3.x. I would like to summarize the features of NPDS 3.x. I had a colleague at INRIA who was convinced that HTTP-based personal data sharing for PDAs is the way to go. And in fact, he convinced me as well. So I would like to work towards Matt's initial idea, which is making NPDS a web interface for the data on the Newton, instead of stressing the pure web serving part which I was more interested it. I think that NPDS shall allow us to view and modify data on the Newton. But not like on the Newton itself, it should rather be a publish mechanism with some update mechanisms whenever a keyboard and a big screen are more suitable than pen. My problem with that was that I don't really want to publish my card file on the web. Some of us do it but I think that most don't. I don't want to publish my agenda either, etc. Therefore we come to the core of NPDS features: - it shall have a user login/logout interface that must be optional (guest mode). I hate it when I have to login on Apple's website. This means handling cookies. This also means that there should be permissions within the plug-ins. For example people in some group could see your card file and only you can modify it. This login thing will replace the Notes post/web pager identity. - it shall have a website aspect that can be customized with themes. We can all customize the web pages but plug-ins shall be customizable. Using CSS might be sufficient, however it means that plug-ins must rely much more on CSSes. For that part, I wish the talented web designers on the list make some mock NPDS 3.x websites with various themes so the layman Newton user could just pick one in a popup. I think we discussed that already. I trust the CSS experts to tell me what should define a given theme. - the notes server will be merged with works and splitted in several parts: * web structure (including error documents, etc.) and themes notes (which could be in works) will be merged into the core module. They are always required. This also means that there will not be a default module on the contrary to 2.x. I don't think anyone doesn't use Notes as the default module. This module will include admin posting feature (i.e. something that let you add notes to the Newton with permissions). * there could be a bulletin board module (replacing posting notes/listing of owner's notes). * there should be a Wiki module. * there might be a blog-like module. - the gif server module shall be splitted in two parts: * the gif encoder shall go into the core (and could be used to serve themes picture elements). I might add png and jpeg encoding. * the screen module will display the screen content and let you (with permissions) click on it. Like VNC but via HTTP with authentication. - the dates and card file modules shall let you modify/add entries - the binary module will be merged into core because it is required for themes pictures. - the tracker will stay as a separate module. Some people here don't use it and it's not because it brings instability, it's because they don't want/can't share their Newton. - the watcher shall be merged into the core. The part that checks that NPDS is still serving is mainly a workaround for bugs. But it has two other interesting features that we might want to keep: (a) it restarts NPDS on reboot (except at Paul Filmer's) and (b) it reboots if the NS task seemed to crash (this can happen if some other software crashed it). - there shall be some mechanism (probably HTTP based) to update pages and content remotely. This will go into Core. So in the end, we'll have: - Core - BB - Wiki - Blog - Screen - Tracker - Dates - Card File - Pager What did I forget? Is there any feature that you would like to see? And the next question: do you want to help and how? Paul - -- NPDS: http://newton.kallisys.net:8080/ Apache: http://www.kallisys.com/ [NPDS Mailing List: To unsubscribe: mailto:npds-request@ml.free.fr?subject=unsubscribe] -------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 09:39:49 -0500 Subject: [NPDS] Re: Towards NPDS 3, let's summarize From: John Skinner I think it would be nice to be able to reply to a "Pager" message, like invoking a form of instant messaging. For example; If I had my Newton running (the future) NPDS 3 and someone sent me a Pager" message.. I would have the choice to dismiss the message window (like WebPager), OR, I could tap a "Reply" button (that might even load a third-party messaging program, i.e. Chatbuddy, NewtCQ, NewtJabber etc.) and start a chat session. I know that not everyone might want this type of functionality from NPDS 3, but it's just my 2 cents! >> From: Paul Guyot >> Reply-To: npds@ml.free.fr >> Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 10:05:50 +0200 >> To: npds@ml.free.fr >> Subject: [NPDS] Towards NPDS 3, let's summarize >> > >> So in the end, we'll have: >> - Core >> - BB >> - Wiki >> - Blog >> - Screen >> - Tracker >> - Dates >> - Card File >> - Pager >> >> What did I forget? Is there any feature that you would like to see? >> >> And the next question: do you want to help and how? >> >> Paul > > ----------------- > John Skinner > Computer Systems Administrator > Vanderbilt University > john.skinner@vanderbilt.edu > Got Problems?... click on the link below and fill out a request. > http://kls.kirkland.vanderbilt.edu/ - ------ End of Forwarded Message [NPDS Mailing List: To unsubscribe: mailto:npds-request@ml.free.fr?subject=unsubscribe] -------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 10:43:51 -0400 (EDT) From: chuma@misato.chuma.org Subject: [NPDS] Re: Towards NPDS 3, let's summarize On Thu, 19 Sep 2002, John Skinner wrote: > I think it would be nice to be able to reply to a "Pager" message, like > invoking a form of instant messaging. > > For example; > If I had my Newton running (the future) NPDS 3 and someone sent me a Pager" > message.. > > I would have the choice to dismiss the message window (like WebPager), > OR, > I could tap a "Reply" button (that might even load a third-party messaging > program, i.e. Chatbuddy, NewtCQ, NewtJabber etc.) and start a chat session. Yes. This would probably mean that the alternative messaging method would have to be sent along with the message, which means that the sender would have to have the info entered somewhere - most logically, in their owner's card. I actually used to have something like this running on a webpage a long time ago. I could send someone a webpager message from a special form I had (entering their IP address), and then when they replied they would go to another form (not on an NPDS server) where they could send an SMS in reply. - -- - ------Victor Rehorst -- victor@eddie.cis.uoguelph.ca | chuma@chuma.org------ - ---- Webmaster, United Network of Newton Archives: http://www.unna.org ---- - -------------- Homepage and Newton Stuff: http://www.chuma.org ------------- [NPDS Mailing List: To unsubscribe: mailto:npds-request@ml.free.fr?subject=unsubscribe] -------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 22:15:50 -0400 (EDT) From: chuma@misato.chuma.org Subject: [NPDS] Re: Towards NPDS 3, let's summarize On Thu, 19 Sep 2002, Paul Guyot wrote: > * there might be a blog-like module. I would put a blog-like module over a Wiki, personally. > - the gif server module shall be splitted in two parts: > * the gif encoder shall go into the core (and could be used to serve > themes picture elements). I might add png and jpeg encoding. But this would mean that people who use Screen Shooter would have to keep an old version of GIF server around, or have NPDS core installed... or am I misunderstanding you? Why not just make the GIF encoder a library like zlib? > - the dates and card file modules shall let you modify/add entries Dates/Names should import/export vCalendar/vCard. > - the tracker will stay as a separate module. Some people here don't > use it and it's not because it brings instability, it's because they > don't want/can't share their Newton. The tracker and the tracker server should also implement the stuff that we've dreamed about it doing: sending lon/lats for map graphing, possibly other cool stuff. I forget now, it's been so long since we talked about it. Maybe x-face images, for fun? > What did I forget? Is there any feature that you would like to see? Web*Pager could be so much cooler, as was already noted. > And the next question: do you want to help and how? I mentioned the tracker stuff. I'm not sure how else I can help... - -- - ------Victor Rehorst -- victor@eddie.cis.uoguelph.ca | chuma@chuma.org------ - ---- Webmaster, United Network of Newton Archives: http://www.unna.org ---- - -------------- Homepage and Newton Stuff: http://www.chuma.org ------------- [NPDS Mailing List: To unsubscribe: mailto:npds-request@ml.free.fr?subject=unsubscribe] -------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: [NPDS] Re: Towards NPDS 3, let's summarize Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 22:04:31 -0600 From: Grant [Chop House] Hutchinson In a previous message, Paul Guyot typed vigorously: >What did I forget? Is there any feature that you would like to see? I need more time to chew through all the options and possibilities, but I think we've already got about 90% of my wish list covered already. >And the next question: do you want to help and how? I've already mentioned in previous threads that I'd like to be involved in renovating the documentation, as well as designing a series of html/xhtml/css compliant templates or perhaps something called NPDS SiteSkins(tm). In order to work on the latter, I'd like to start compiling a list of pages and web interfaces that each module would use, the various levels of information hierarchy on those pages, and so forth. Oh, I'm so excited... g. ...................................................................... Grant Hutchinson Interface Considerations & Toys Live video served fresh since 1996. http://www.splorp.com/cam/ Now fortified with daily ramblings. http://www.splorp.com/blog/ Newton. It's the Palm with a brain. http://www.splorp.com/newton/ Online community web site handyman. http://www.newted.net/ [NPDS Mailing List: To unsubscribe: mailto:npds-request@ml.free.fr?subject=unsubscribe] -------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2002 08:00:53 +0200 From: Paul Guyot Subject: [NPDS] Re: Towards NPDS 3, let's summarize > > * there might be a blog-like module. > >I would put a blog-like module over a Wiki, personally. Sorry for this question that might seem dumb, but you mean that you prefer that to Wiki or you want to run it on Wiki? > > - the gif server module shall be splitted in two parts: >> * the gif encoder shall go into the core (and could be used to serve >> themes picture elements). I might add png and jpeg encoding. > >But this would mean that people who use Screen Shooter would have to keep >an old version of GIF server around, or have NPDS core installed... or am >I misunderstanding you? Why not just make the GIF encoder a library like >zlib? Oh yeah, I forgot Screen Shooter. 'Kay, it should be a library-like separate module. I'll have to discuss with Daniel. (and the png encoder will actually be part of the ZLib because of their relationship). > > - the dates and card file modules shall let you modify/add entries > >Dates/Names should import/export vCalendar/vCard. Noted. > > - the tracker will stay as a separate module. Some people here don't >> use it and it's not because it brings instability, it's because they >> don't want/can't share their Newton. > >The tracker and the tracker server should also implement the stuff that >we've dreamed about it doing: sending lon/lats for map graphing, possibly >other cool stuff. I forget now, it's been so long since we talked about >it. Maybe x-face images, for fun? Great, a new dream-like idea for the tracker: x-faces. >Web*Pager could be so much cooler, as was already noted. Yes. In fact, we discussed about these improvements a while back on that list. Paul - -- NPDS: http://newton.kallisys.net:8080/ Apache: http://www.kallisys.com/ [NPDS Mailing List: To unsubscribe: mailto:npds-request@ml.free.fr?subject=unsubscribe] -------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2002 08:03:04 +0200 From: Paul Guyot Subject: [NPDS] Re: Towards NPDS 3, let's summarize >In order to work on the latter, I'd like to start compiling a list of >pages and web interfaces that each module would use, the various levels >of information hierarchy on those pages, and so forth. Indeed, this is what to start with. Please don't forget error pages (with permissions, we'll have at least 404, 403 and 500). Everything should wear the SiteSkin. >Oh, I'm so excited... All that is reasonable. Nobody asked for PHP support yet. Paul - -- NPDS: http://newton.kallisys.net:8080/ Apache: http://www.kallisys.com/ [NPDS Mailing List: To unsubscribe: mailto:npds-request@ml.free.fr?subject=unsubscribe] --------------------------------------------------------------